| Posted | Nick | Remark | |
|---|---|---|---|
| #openstack-nova - 2022-07-26 | |||
| 16:48:20 | sean-k-mooney | if you use the rbd image_backend | |
| 16:48:37 | bauzas | sean-k-mooney: I don't disagree with you, I'm just explaining our docs | |
| 16:49:17 | sean-k-mooney | yep | |
| 16:50:05 | bauzas | not only our upstream docs btw... https://access.redhat.com/documentation/en-us/red_hat_openstack_platform/16.2/html/creating_and_managing_instances/con_types-of-instance-storage_osp :) | |
| 16:50:12 | sean-k-mooney | so i would prefer something like local_disk_encryption, instance_disk_encypriton or similar | |
| 16:50:29 | sean-k-mooney | bauzas: right but there are many other things wrong with our downstream docs | |
| 16:50:32 | gibi | +1 on local disk encryption | |
| 16:51:55 | bauzas | I'd prefer local disk encryption over instance disk encryption | |
| 16:51:58 | sean-k-mooney | im not going to block this progressing on the name | |
| 16:52:22 | sean-k-mooney | i just find the usage of ephmeral to rever to storage tied to the vms lifecycle to be mildly insulting | |
| 16:52:26 | bauzas | because an instance disk can either be "ephemeral" (from local libvirt disk), or something else | |
| 16:53:02 | bauzas | technically, this ephemeral storage is actually our virt driver local storage | |
| 16:53:21 | bauzas | depending on the virt driver you use | |
| 16:53:30 | sean-k-mooney | its not nessiarly local | |
| 16:53:33 | bauzas | tell ironic about it :) | |
| 16:53:44 | sean-k-mooney | well for libvirt or vmware | |
| 16:53:47 | bauzas | yeah, see, I made that mistake | |
| 16:53:51 | sean-k-mooney | the storage can be clusterd or remote | |
| 16:53:55 | bauzas | shared storage is ephemeral | |
| 16:54:05 | bauzas | so, not local | |
| 16:54:08 | sean-k-mooney | this is why i dont like using that term | |
| 16:54:18 | melwitt | hey o/ thanks for discussing the naming bikeshed :) just wanted to get some confidence that ppl would prefer a name change and lessen the possibility of someone coming to the review later and saying "why did you change this, it should be changed back to ephemeral" | |
| 16:54:27 | sean-k-mooney | ephemeral is ambiguious | |
| 16:54:38 | bauzas | as is "evacuate" :D | |
| 16:54:53 | bauzas | our Gods of Naming didn't help | |
| 16:55:09 | sean-k-mooney | maybe we need dansmith to write another blog post | |
| 16:55:20 | bauzas | problem solved. | |
| 16:55:20 | sean-k-mooney | melwitt: ack so i guess the real question is | |
| 16:55:28 | bauzas | #action dansmith to write a blogpost | |
| 16:55:31 | sean-k-mooney | do we think channging the name will make thing clearer | |
| 16:55:35 | dansmith | heh | |
| 16:55:45 | bauzas | oh, snap, he saw it | |
| 16:55:46 | melwitt | :) | |
| 16:55:46 | bauzas | #undo | |
| 16:55:46 | opendevmeet | Removing item from minutes: #action dansmith to write a blogpost | |
| 16:55:52 | dansmith | In general, I'm not for renaming things like this | |
| 16:56:05 | bauzas | I'm not against renaming ity | |
| 16:56:17 | bauzas | I just wanted to make sure we all agree on what this is | |
| 16:56:30 | bauzas | ephemeral is a bad name, but that's a name we already use | |
| 16:56:34 | dansmith | because you'll end up with all old docs being inaccurate for new stuff, and people who already understand this will also have to change | |
| 16:56:46 | melwitt | that was one of my concerns | |
| 16:56:47 | bauzas | if we pick something else, this has to be better understandable about what it is | |
| 16:57:19 | bauzas | yeah, if we need to write some doc explaining "ephemeral" == "this new thing" this is bad | |
| 16:57:39 | bauzas | hence the challenge | |
| 16:58:00 | gibi | so this is considered a non fixable terminology mistake of the past? | |
| 16:58:08 | bauzas | like tenant ? :) | |
| 16:58:15 | gibi | we are fixing tenant | |
| 16:58:22 | sean-k-mooney | well to me that doc that is erfernce is not a nova doc | |
| 16:58:25 | bauzas | I know, I'm opening a can of worms | |
| 16:58:26 | sean-k-mooney | so we could jsut fix it | |
| 16:58:45 | bauzas | and pretend it never existed, heh ? :) | |
| 16:59:09 | bauzas | we're running out of time, but for the sake of the conversation, let's continue | |
| 16:59:13 | sean-k-mooney | well from my point of view the only thing that nova ever said was ephemreal is the falvor.ephemeral storage disks | |
| 16:59:22 | bauzas | I'll just formally end the meeting at the top of the hour | |
| 16:59:56 | sean-k-mooney | melwitt: are we encypting the flavor.epmermal disks by the way | |
| 17:00:00 | sean-k-mooney | or just root and swap | |
| 17:00:11 | bauzas | problem is | |
| 17:00:17 | sean-k-mooney | i thikn we will be encypting all 3 types | |
| 17:00:17 | bauzas | root is also "ephemeral" | |
| 17:00:28 | bauzas | (depending on the conf options) | |
| 17:00:28 | sean-k-mooney | bauzas: it depend on the difinition | |
| 17:00:31 | sean-k-mooney | form our api its not | |
| 17:00:39 | melwitt | sean-k-mooney: what is "flavor.ephemeral"? it is encrypting the root disk and any other attached local disks | |
| 17:01:09 | sean-k-mooney | in our flavor we have 3 types of storage | |
| 17:01:11 | bauzas | correct, the point is that *by default, we don't do any difference between root disk and other local (or non-local on shared) disk | |
| 17:01:21 | sean-k-mooney | root, swap and ephemeral | |
| 17:01:39 | sean-k-mooney | https://docs.openstack.org/nova/latest/user/flavors.html | |
| 17:01:50 | melwitt | ok, this is encrypting root and ephemeral, and not swap | |
| 17:01:56 | bauzas | right | |
| 17:02:00 | bauzas | about the new feature | |
| 17:02:18 | sean-k-mooney | so we proably should be encyrpting swap too but we can maybe add that next cycle | |
| 17:02:58 | bauzas | swap is out of scope AFAICT | |
| 17:03:10 | sean-k-mooney | im not sure why it would be | |
| 17:03:35 | sean-k-mooney | we declared it out of scope for this cycle i guess | |
| 17:03:47 | sean-k-mooney | but i would hope it woudl get done before we condire this fully complete | |
| 17:03:48 | bauzas | because swap isn't using QEMU file-based storage ? | |
| 17:03:54 | sean-k-mooney | it is | |
| 17:04:00 | sean-k-mooney | depending on your backend | |
| 17:04:11 | bauzas | f*** | |
| 17:04:12 | sean-k-mooney | it will use a qcow files or a rbd volume | |
| 17:04:16 | bauzas | I'm not expert on swap | |
| 17:04:41 | bauzas | then, all disks (root, swap and others) go into a same bucket | |
| 17:04:57 | bauzas | which is by default the virt driver storage backend | |
| 17:05:07 | melwitt | basically this is encrypting things that are under the 'ephemerals' and 'image' keys in block_device_info: https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/nova/+/826529/7/nova/virt/driver.py#107 | |
| 17:05:40 | melwitt | 'swap' has its own key in block_device_info | |
| 17:06:45 | sean-k-mooney | so ephemerals should be the storage form flavor.ephemeral_gb | |
| 17:06:49 | bauzas | do we know if https://docs.openstack.org/nova/latest/configuration/config.html?highlight=ephemeral#DEFAULT.default_ephemeral_format is also used for root and swap ? | |
| 17:07:01 | sean-k-mooney | image is presumable the storage form flavor.root_gb | |
| 17:07:05 | melwitt | I don't know the reason swap is not included and I just checked the specs again and don't find it mentioned why | |
| 17:07:24 | sean-k-mooney | bauzas: no i belive that is for ephemeral_gb only | |
| 17:08:29 | sean-k-mooney | bauzas if you dont specy how you want flavor.ephemeral_gb to be devied up on the server create api request | |
| 17:08:38 | sean-k-mooney | we use that config to determin the format | |
| 17:08:53 | sean-k-mooney | and we provide a single ephemeral disk | |
| 17:09:27 | sean-k-mooney | but you can ask for nova to provide multiple disks as long as the total is equal to or less then flavor.ephemeral_gb | |
| 17:09:56 | bauzas | looks like I need to end this meeting | |
| 17:10:01 | bauzas | but let's continue | |
| 17:10:02 | sean-k-mooney | this gets modeled in the block device mapping info passed in the api request | |
| 17:10:04 | sean-k-mooney | ack | |
| 17:10:07 | bauzas | #endmeeting | |
| 17:10:07 | opendevmeet | Meeting ended Tue Jul 26 17:10:07 2022 UTC. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4) | |