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#openstack-nova - 2022-03-08
16:47:40 bauzas gibi: I have Autopilot (c)
16:47:48 gibi nice :)
16:47:54 bauzas nah, kidding
16:48:19 gibi don't give alcohol to the Autopilot then :)
16:48:33 bauzas in Europe, you need to hold your steering wheel every 15 fucking seconds
16:49:12 gibi but I guess it is enough to hold it with one hand, so with the other you can still hold the beer :)
16:49:58 gibi sean-k-mooney: lol
16:50:30 bauzas gibi: this works with any automatic gearbox :p
16:50:47 gibi don't tell me your tesla has a stick :D
16:51:29 bauzas sean-k-mooney: lol about the black eyed peas
16:51:50 gibi anyhow I hope you enjoy the new car
16:52:00 bauzas gibi: indeed
16:53:10 sean-k-mooney you know its one thing ill miss when i swap to eletric. i like driving a manual/stick shift
16:53:35 sean-k-mooney that said i do like the curse control in my i30 too
16:56:42 bauzas sean-k-mooney: fwiw, my first daughter is about to start driving
16:56:49 bauzas in 2 years-ish
16:57:09 sean-k-mooney do ye have the same rule that if you passs in an automatic you cannot drive a manual
16:57:11 bauzas sean-k-mooney: given we only have automatic gearbox cars, she'll learn on those
16:57:19 bauzas sean-k-mooney: correct but,
16:58:05 sean-k-mooney honestly in her lifetime it might be at the point were it wont matter for most people
16:58:06 bauzas once she gets her driving licence (only accepting to drive automatic cars), she'll be able to take 6 hours of lessons with manual gearbox cars
16:58:15 bauzas that's the plan we have
16:58:30 sean-k-mooney well in ireland she woudl have to resit the test
16:58:37 bauzas easier to get the license first, and then learn with the manual cars
17:00:02 bauzas this is different here, you have about to pass a formal theorical exam when you are 15
17:00:41 bauzas and then you're on a "learning period" when you can drive your parent's car provided an adult is with you
17:01:01 bauzas at 18, you can pass the practical exam when you drive
17:01:20 bauzas which allows you to be on probation for 2 years only
17:01:28 bauzas but you can drive alon
17:01:29 bauzas alone
17:02:17 sean-k-mooney that basically the same here
17:02:49 sean-k-mooney but to get your licene updated to allow you to drive a manual if you passed in an automatic you have to do the pratical driving test again
17:03:16 sean-k-mooney like add the -e option to allow trailers or addign another catagory
17:04:41 bauzas sean-k-mooney: I see, the only difference then is that there is no practical driving "official" test
17:04:45 bauzas (again I mean)
17:05:07 bauzas sean-k-mooney: after 3 months once you get your license, you can take a 7-hour class about driving a manual
17:05:43 sean-k-mooney ya that is simpler if she wants to do that
17:05:46 bauzas after those 7 hours, the driving school gives you a paper that validates your skills
17:06:01 bauzas and you don't need to pass an exam again
17:06:20 rribaud__ bauzas, sean-k-mooney , regarding the ssh rsa key creation removal. Maybe it is something I can do ? That looks not too hard ?
17:06:38 bauzas rribaud__: this is just about deprecating an API
17:06:45 bauzas technically an easy peasy
17:06:57 bauzas but there be dragons with the explanation
17:07:22 sean-k-mooney rribaud__: well in this cycle it just deprecation and then it removal would happen in a new micoroverison but we need to consider the new tick tock life cycle too
17:07:45 sean-k-mooney rribaud__: for the most part we dont actully remove api code
17:07:54 sean-k-mooney we just disable it in the new microverion
17:08:07 sean-k-mooney since we key the fucntionality in old microverions
17:08:44 bauzas sean-k-mooney: IIUC, zed would be tock release
17:09:06 sean-k-mooney yes so we cant actully remvoe it until A
17:09:18 bauzas no
17:09:28 sean-k-mooney if we deprecate in yoga or zed we cant remove it until the next tick
17:09:28 bauzas that's not what I understood
17:09:34 bauzas given yoga was a tick release
17:09:48 dansmith to be clear, neither are tick or tock
17:09:49 bauzas we can't remove in the next tick release
17:10:31 dansmith tick-tock starts at A.. but thinking about this in terms of tick-tock is good exercise for sure
17:10:35 bauzas dansmith: damn, you should write a book "New OpenStack release cadence for Dummies"
17:10:56 sean-k-mooney dansmith: the patch mentioned treatign yoga to A as a dry run
17:10:57 dansmith bauzas: just consider tock as a milestone release
17:11:09 bauzas dansmith: that's what I understood
17:11:22 bauzas dansmith: so removing an API deprecated in zed would be C, right?
17:11:22 dansmith sean-k-mooney: yep, that's why I say going through the exercise is good, but it's not in force yet, is all I'm saying
17:11:37 bauzas it would be harsh if we would remove in A
17:11:56 dansmith bauzas: yes, but if you really deprecate it in zed, you would need to make sure that A *also* has it in the renos because people not deploying tock releases won't read those renos
17:12:02 sean-k-mooney "Y->A should be a "dress rehearsal" where we have the jobs enabled to help smoke out any issues, but where hard guarantees are not yet made."
17:12:36 bauzas dansmith: that's what I understood again
17:12:43 sean-k-mooney in anycase we woudl not remove this till A beacuew we likely wont deprecate in y at this point so the deprecation will be in zed
17:12:51 bauzas I'm assuming our relnotes won't be that read for Zed
17:12:56 dansmith bauzas: btw, doc fro the p-t-g: https://review.opendev.org/c/openstack/project-team-guide/+/832126/1/doc/source/deprecation.rst
17:13:16 sean-k-mooney bauzas: why i think that is not something we should assume
17:13:32 bauzas that reminds me to add an item to the nova etherpad about the cadence
17:13:39 sean-k-mooney im expecting that each tick will have the deperaction fomr the previous tick and tock
17:14:28 bauzas fortunately, we only have tick and tock releases and not Huey, Dewey and Louie releases
17:14:53 sean-k-mooney if we deprecate someitng in a tock are you sayign we need to keep it for a tick, tock and then we can remove in the second tick
17:15:39 bauzas sean-k-mooney: the new release cadence implies that tock releases are intermediate
17:15:43 gmann sean-k-mooney: issue in that is notification, if anyone not monitoring tock release as they can upgrade tick->tick
17:15:52 dansmith yes, because you haven't deprecated it in a release that those people are running
17:15:54 gmann so they miss the deprecation in tock
17:15:55 dansmith right
17:15:56 bauzas sean-k-mooney: there is no benefit into deprecating anything in a tock release
17:16:11 dansmith bauzas: pretty much that, yeah
17:16:18 sean-k-mooney hum ok so that basically means that we only deprecate in ticks
17:16:30 bauzas dansmith: again, are we assuming zed like a tock release unofficially, then ?
17:16:31 sean-k-mooney and then remove in the next tick at the earliest
17:16:41 bauzas sean-k-mooney: you're correct
17:17:08 bauzas to quote dansmith, tock releases are tick-4 releases
17:17:14 dansmith bauzas: unofficially yeah, yoga is "practice tick", zed is "practice tock" and then we commit on AA
17:17:39 bauzas tick-4 s/releases/milestones my bad
17:17:48 sean-k-mooney if we deprecated in a tick is there any reason not to remove in the next tock
17:17:51 bauzas dansmith: ack, pretty clear now
17:18:00 sean-k-mooney since the notice would have been given
17:18:12 sean-k-mooney and for tick to tick upgrades ther is no delta
17:18:18 bauzas sean-k-mooney: no, you need to wait the next tick to remove
17:18:34 sean-k-mooney why if its tick to tick you cant tell the difference
17:18:35 dansmith sean-k-mooney: well, for people deploying all of them, you'd normally give two cycles yeah? depending on what it is
17:18:35 bauzas sean-k-mooney: again, thinking in terms of milestones helps
17:19:01 sean-k-mooney well we give at least one but up to two but sure
17:19:05 bauzas fun, timeout on the PTG schedule agenda https://ethercalc.openstack.org/7yxdas7suqnd
17:19:08 bauzas is it me ?
17:19:13 sean-k-mooney *not up to but offten two

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